One of the most powerful men in Cambodia is Hun Manith, the second son of Prime Minister Hun Sen. In 2015, Mr. Manith was appointed as director of the Defense Ministry’s military intelligence unit, a crucial role in keeping the country safe from external as well as internal threats. In a frank interview with Khmer Times, Mr. Manith tackles issues from the Black Monday protests to regime change, and in typical style he doesn’t pull any punches. His answers may shock some, but his determination to protect the constitution, monarchy and the people will come as no surprise.
KT: As the Deputy Cabinet Chief and the Head of Military Intelligence, what are your views on the rise of the Black Monday protest in the past few weeks?
Hun Manith: For the past two weeks there were many discussions about the Black Monday and I also got many questions concerning this black color protest from friends and colleagues. First of all, it does not matter what color they are using, either black, blue, red or green, but what matters most is to promote a symbol within the society.
The call for people to wear black every Monday came after the arrest of a few NGO workers. This call is to show solidarity among NGOs and also to mobilize people to defy the government. The small mobilization is a start and will lead to bigger demonstrations if it is not kept under control.
It might look simple to the general public, however it is not as simple as it seems to be. At the moment there are a concerted attacks on the government from within and outside of the country to create a negative image of the government.
What we are asking is for them to follow and not break any laws within the country.
KT: How would this be viewed in the broader context of regime change and also in a narrower perspective of creating internal instability?
Hun Manith: Even though the protest is still small, but as we have seen in the past and in other countries, the small protest might lead to a bigger one when outsiders come in. The outsiders usually provide support such as strategies, funding, moral support, intervention with the government, blackmailing government officials, bribing them and putting other pressures so that the government remains passive.
The black color is a symbol to create a division between the people. A symbol that the NGOs and the opposition can refer to when marching against the government.
The color is a start and more symbols will come later as we have seen the hand sign that started to be used by several NGOs recently. The hand sign we have also seen in Eastern Europe, which was used by their NGOs to promote people power within those countries.
There are many ways to create and promote a people power revolution within a society as we have seen from other countries that were affected by this disease. So far those countries that were affected did not have any peace and stability after the change.
People are dying every day ever since. In Cambodia, after the election in 2013, we have seen something similar to the Middle East and Eastern Europe countries where revolutions took place. However, the government was able to keep the situation under control so we preserved the peace and stability within our country, which resulted in great economic growth.
As you might be aware, this kind of regime change took place near and after an election and Cambodia will have a commune election in 2017. Is it a coincidence?
In order to succeed in mobilizing the people for regime change, they need to create a negative perception about the government, for locals and also in the international arena. Once the perspective succeeds, all the means and tactics for regime change will be justified.
KT: Some of the protesters appear to be old and senior citizens. Are they real protesters or are they being manipulated by certain quarters to carry out their protests?
Hun Manith: The senior protestors are well known within Cambodia as well as abroad for their frequent protest on land, human right or democracy issues. It is becoming their work and lifestyle to earn a living via the Khmer diaspora and foreign funding.
They started demonstrating only on land issues a few years ago. Since then, they have joined almost all demonstrations within Phnom Penh as long as their voices and photos can be heard, taken and spread across the media.
The louder their voices are, the more funding they will receive. The purpose of keeping these small groups going is not only to help promote the role of NGOs and associations within the Kingdom, but also to help spread a negative image of the government.
In fact, we need to strengthen our law and order so the majority of the population can enjoy their freedoms and enjoy the economic growth.
KT: The government has often been accused of using excessive force against protestors who claim that demonstrating is their civil and democratic right. Could you comment on this please?
Hun Manith: We have laws and regulations within Cambodia, the same as other countries. Those who act against the law would be punished by the law, the same as in other countries. If they comply with the law, there should be nothing wrong with a protest as long as the protest is not politically motivated.
We should firstly look at the nature of the protest and who is involved. There are many protests that were done annually within Cambodia and the majority of them were done peacefully and without incidents. However, there were a few protests that led to the arrest of the protesters.
We had a lot of complaints from local citizens concerning those protests and the local government was blamed for inaction for letting those protest take place again and again. Blocking roads is illegal in Cambodia and I do believe that other countries are similar. Therefore, after several warnings about not blocking the road, we had no choice but to act according to the law.
Before I continue on the proportional use of force against protests in Cambodia, I would like to recall the Ferguson protests in the United States in 2014. When the protests started, the US government used a good proportional force to subdue the protest.
They had called out the military as well as the use of armored vehicles against the so called peaceful protest. So if we compare to that use of force, I’ll say we are nowhere near them. I don’t think we can afford the pepper spray like the rich countries when tackling a protest. We don’t have big horses to deter the protester. We don’t have fancy body armor like they do to make the protester think twice before deciding to continue longer.
KT: How do you view the overall security situation in the country, external threats as well as domestic threats?
Hun Manith: The overall security situation in Cambodia has been very stable since early 2014 where an attempt at regime change failed. With the peace and stability returned, Cambodia’s economy has performed better than most of our neighbors. With the good economic growth, the population as a whole is benefiting from it. The government is working hard to preserve the peace and stability in order to promote more development and economic growth for the country.
What is happening in Cambodia for the past decade is not a separate phenomenon, but it is the result of a long-term conflict between the superpowers within the region and within the world. As a foreign officer once told me “it is alright to have many superpowers as long as the United States is on top.”
Unfortunately, Cambodia is in the middle of that conflict. You might know the term “if you are not with us, you are against us”, and this is what I see at the moment. That being said, a threat always exists for us as long as we are independent.
KT: You have said before that your professional and moral responsibility is to protect the country and monarchy against any attempts to destabilize both. Can you elaborate on this?
Hun Manith: What I had raised before still remains strong with me and other security officials. What we had sworn to do and our responsibility is to protect the constitution, the monarchy, the people, the country and the government – that will always be with us.
Therefore, we will do everything to protect them, even giving up my life to protect what has been built up until now. Me and my siblings had sworn to our late King Father at the Royal Palace, when he was still alive, that we will always protect the monarchy.
As I have raised earlier, Cambodia is still a small country located in the middle of several giants which is in danger because of the fight for supremacy.